Chris Katulka: Thanks for joining us for The Friends of Israel Today. I'm your host and teacher, Chris Katulka. But today I'm going to be turning it over to our Executive Producer, Steve Conover, who had the opportunity to interview our Executive Director, Dr. Jim Showers, at the Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry the morning after Iran attacked Israel. It's a fantastic interview to catch you up on why did Iran attack Israel and what was the significance of this attack and what can we expect? And so Jim's going to give us some insights into that. And just a reminder, this was the morning after the attack, so if there's any additional news or information that you need to hear, be sure to go to foiradio.org to keep up with news that's coming out of Israel. We’ll turn it over to Steve now.

Steve Conover: This is a breaking news edition of Israel at War. I'm Steve Conover. I'm joined by Dr. Jim Showers, the Executive Director of the Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry. Good morning, Jim.

Jim Showers: Morning Steve. We're talking to each other from a distance.

Steve Conover: Yes, yes. You'll notice we're not in the studio. It's Sunday morning at the time of this recording and we're unable to get into the studio, but it was important enough that we get together to give you a response from the Friends of Israel on this important topic. Jim, after days of threats that Iran was planning a direct attack on Israel, late yesterday afternoon, Saturday, news broke that Iran launched drone and missile attacks at Israel. The first thing that I thought of is this is very intriguing because this is the first time there's been a direct attack. It's usually through their proxies. What does this mean for Israel that this is the first time Iran has done this as a direct attack?

Jim Showers: Well, I think it's very significant, Steve. First of all, one of the things we're hearing consistently in the media from Israeli officials is that this is a game-changer. In the past, Iran worked exclusively, as you said, through proxies to attack Israel. And so we knew Iran was behind it all, that as a given fact. But Iran never had their hands on the weapons directly. This is very significant because it now opens the door for Israel to directly attack Iran at any time it so chooses. One of the things we have to keep in mind, the Iranians are very intelligent people, so everything they do is very strategic. And so I think what we saw yesterday, it's being reported, and we have to keep in mind it's very fluid. More information is going to be coming out in the hours and days ahead. But right now the report is over 300 drones and missiles.

There were two kinds of missiles, both ballistic as well as cruise ballistic missiles have a much higher arc. They're shot up into the air and then come back down whereas the cruise missiles fly just above the ground, but they both bring the same kind of payloads. So there's that significance in that Israel now is likely going to respond, exactly how, we don't know, and when, we don't know. But this certainly seems that this would set up a response from Israel. Israel's been saying all along, "If we are struck by Iran, we will hit them back and they will know we've hit them." So sometimes that's a saber-rattling. But this case when Israel threatens to do something, they normally do it. It is interesting, I think too, that in part of the strategy of Iran, they used older technology. They didn't use some of their most modern weapons that they have at their disposal.

And I would imagine that they probably anticipated that most would not make it through. That may have been part of the calculation that they wanted to send a clear message that we feel emboldened to strike Israel directly, but we're not ready for a major war otherwise they would've launched more and they would launch some of their better technology and their weapons systems. So we see a lot of change in perspective to this ongoing conflict. And now Iran has joined into not just using proxies, but signal that they will use their own weapon systems directly on Israel anytime they see fit. Now, the other thing I think is really significant is that Israel was joined by the US in defending against these weapons. They also flew north of the border of Israel into Syrian and Jordanian airspace to attack and destroy these missiles and drones before they could reach Israel.

Many got through, but we're hearing this morning that 99% of all of the weapons that were fired by Iran yesterday were destroyed before they could reach their target. And the drones, people may not realize this, those are called suicide drones. Their sole purpose is to fly to their target, lock in on it, and then dive straight into the target. And when they hit the ground, they explode. So they're not designed like a lot of drones where they carry weapon systems and then return to a base. And so we know that there was very little damage done from this. That may have been part of Iran's calculation as well, is to send a clear message without doing a lot of damage that would bring Israel into a major war. But this has the potential to get the Middle East into a major war. And it has the attention of certainly all the Western nations as well as all the Arab nations in the Middle East.

Steve Conover: I thought it was interesting to see that both the US and the UK responded, which encouraged my heart to see that they had an immediate response in support of Israel. And you mentioned the outdated technology. It's again, a reminder of how small Israel is. They just send masses of waves of ballistics toward Israel, but many of them landed in Jordan, which is 400% larger than Israel. So there's no way without older technology to be that precise with some of those weapons. So I think it's, again, a reminder of how small Israel is in that region. But it's been reported in the past that Israel has orchestrated the destruction of nuclear facilities in Iran. And you mentioned the strategic element of Iran that they may have very well known that these waves would not be effective, but Israel will respond. That's what we anticipate. Knowing that Israel has gone into Iran in the past reportedly, what should we think about a threat for Iran to step it up even higher to a nuclear campaign?

Jim Showers: Well, first of all, people often aren't aware of how small Israel is in the context of the whole Middle East. If you were to compare the Middle East to the United States, okay, the Middle East, the landmass of the Middle East comprises about 90% of the US and Israel is the size of the state we reside in, New Jersey, so not really very large at all. And I think some of the reports of missiles landing in Jordan May be missiles that were struck on their way to Israel. And perhaps that was collateral damage. Because we know that Israel used their weapon systems, iron dome and other systems, they have to take these missiles down as well as fighter jets. But when they're intercepted and destroyed in the air, their scrap metal that falls to the ground, it is very dangerous to be in the location of where that scrap metal falls because it can kill people.

When we think in terms of Iran and nuclear weapons, Iran right now is on the threshold, and we read this in the media, it's on the threshold of being a nuclear country, having nuclear weapons. Uranium, as I understand, it has to be 90% grade in order to be able to use as a weapon. And right now they've been stockpiling uranium at 60%, which is within 30% of what they need. But what people often miss is the fact that to go from 60 to 90% takes a very short time. It takes a long time to get to 60%, but that last step doesn't take long. And so certainly appears that Iran's strategy is to build up a large stockpile of uranium that within just a few weeks they could convert into weapons-grade uranium. In the meantime, they've been developing their delivery systems, their missile systems that can carry the nuclear warheads.

And so once Iran does launch out into becoming a nuclear power, they want to have not just one or two or three nuclear weapons, they want to have a whole arsenal of them. And that seems to be the path they're on. When will they do this? It's pure speculation. But in the meantime, as you alluded to, Israel's been orchestrating attacks on their nuclear systems over the years. We've seen them, for example, the centrifuges that they use that are critical to developing the uranium into weapons-grade, Israel's attacked those, caused those to stop, prematurely destroying the units. There's been explosions at many of the sites that are a part of the nuclear program, all that's presumed to be Israel's work.

We also remember a few years ago when they actually were able to put a team into Israel that captured a lot of the information about the nuclear program that was previously hidden from the world and brought it back to Israel and disclosed it. So Israel's been actively at work doing what they can, but it's limited. In order to really strike hard, Israel would have to attack Iran directly. One of the reasons I believe we're where we're at today and having this discussion is because of the foreign policy of our current administration, it projects weakness and that weakness emboldens the enemies of Israel and the US. Had we a stronger administration, I don't think we'd be here today having this discussion, but we have to deal with what the situation is.

So in congratulating Prime Minister Netanyahu for the great work yesterday, our president also warned him not to strike Iran. Our president has a track record of making threats and using the word "don't." But when our enemies cross the lines in the sand, little is done. But this is an administration that believes everything can be settled with diplomacy that is seen by Iran and their proxies as weakness. It just emboldens them to launch attacks like this and continue because they're committed to the destruction and elimination of the state of Israel. And that is not going to go away. That is part of their theology. They will continue to wage the war against Israel, and we are not going to see that change anytime soon.

Steve Conover: Yeah. And Israel needs to do what they need to do and they'll do all they can to protect their people. And even waking up this morning, we're seeing news of different countries around the world asking Israel not to take it to the next step, which even Russia was in on that group. And I just find it so humanly perplexing that they would have the nerve to talk about escalating situations.

Jim Showers: Well, if you understand, their fear is this is going to turn into World War III is what they're calling it, a major war in the Middle East that would draw them in. They don't want that. So their fear of war causes them to want to take a lesser ground of response. One of the things Israel could do to respond to this is to quickly move into Rafah and finish the destruction of Hamas. Because where this to turn into a full-fledged war is we would rather not still be fighting Hamas to get that over with before they have to focus on the other proxies of Iran and perhaps Iran directly. So there's different things Israel can do, and you have to trust that leadership is weighing all those things and will make the appropriate response.

We look at things beyond just the physical, right? In Ephesians 6, Paul reminds us that the real battle isn't with flesh and blood. And what we saw yesterday with flesh and blood warfare, for us as human beings, we see things in terms of what we understand as human beings, our flesh and blood. And so people are looking at the political implications here and what is going to be the correct response and what is Israel going to do and how is Iran going to respond to whatever Israel does and they worry themselves. But what people aren't really looking at is, first of all, the religious war that finds this, Islam. A faithful Muslim believes that the land of Israel, modern Israel, is a land that belongs to Allah.

And so it's their obligation, according to the Koran, to take that land back for Allah. And whether that happens in a few weeks, a few months, a few years or a millennia that doesn't matter, they will continue to pursue the battle, [inaudible 00:14:11] the opposition. So we're watching this, but what overrides, even though religious warfare is the spiritual warfare that Paul talks about there in Ephesians 6:12, because he tells us the real battle is a spiritual battle that takes place in the heavens above and it influences what happens here on earth. And so Israel, if you look at what the Bible teaches about Israel, the Bible tells us that Israel is the nation through which God is working His plan to restore this earth.

And therefore, Satan's promised destruction that goes all the way back to Genesis 3 goes through Israel because of Genesis 12 where God made a covenant with Abraham. Those covenants are still enforced, they're still valid, and God has not completed what He promised to do. So Israel faces great attack century after century because of this unique role that Israel plays. No other nation plays that role like Israel plays it. They are the ones to whom God made the covenants and to whom those covenants still apply.

Steve Conover: Yeah. We are often asked, at the Friends of Israel, especially since October 7th, if the escalations in the Middle East are a sign of the end times, how should we think about not just October 7th, but the events of yesterday and what might be coming? How do we think of them in light of biblical prophecy in the end times?

Jim Showers: Well, I know there are some who are quick to say we're in the end times, but what's going on today doesn't line up with what the Bible tells us is the end times. The end times is a period, a short period of time in which God is judging the earth before He restores His kingdom and before He restores His kingdom, He has to return His son Jesus Christ the Messiah. So Jesus talked about that in Matthew 24. Daniel talks about it in Daniel chapter 9, where God reveals to Daniel that there will come a prince from the people who destroy the temple that will enter into a contract. We understand the end times really begins there, but even before the end times begins, there are some key events, one of which would be the rapture of the church.

God will signal the end of the time of the Gentiles with the rapture of the church. And then sometime after that, but probably not a long time after that, will come this covenant. So if you think in terms of what's been going on since October 7th, there's some significant things, I believe, that we can glean from that without having to say something. The Bible, I don't believe supports that we're in the end times. Certainly we're seeing events line up that could be the setup for the end times, and yet we can't put a timeframe on that. Everybody that I talked to seems to feel like the end must be right around the corner because of the way the world's going. But the world's been in bad shape in virtually every century, and people felt like maybe we're getting close to the end times and it hasn't happened yet.

We do know God's calendar is His calendar, it's not our calendar. We don't determine His calendar, He determines His calendar. But we do see key things happening that go in the direction of what we understand of the end times. For example, as I said, one of the significant things was the US joined by the UK. Even some reports that Jordan helped and Saudi Arabia helped with the defense of this attack. That means something really significant in terms of Israel's policy since it became a nation again. The founders of Israel argued that Israel needed to come into existence so the Jewish people had a place where they could defend themselves because where they were scattered, they were at the mercy of the governments of those countries.

And often those governments betrayed that trust and actually were involved in persecuting as, for example, the Holocaust. In Daniel 9:26 we read about a covenant that will be made with the Jewish people. And that covenant we understand to be a covenant that promises protection and peace. The founders of Israel said, "We should never again be reliant on another country defending us." And throughout Israel's history, that's really been true. Israel's always fought its own wars, not asked other countries to join in on the wars. But yesterday something different happened. Yesterday, other nations joined in. And for us as Americans, listen, it was great to see that even with the recent pressure by the US for Israel to pull out of Gaza to end the war, not to go into Rafah.

Even with all that, the US still stands with Israel, defense of the country, but it was the involvement of other countries in the defense of Israel. Yesterday, I found to be very significant and interesting because in order for Israel to enter into a covenant, it has to trust another nation or group of nations to come to its defense. And yesterday we saw that the United States, the United Kingdom, and some others did come to help Israel in the defense of this attack by Iran that's going in the direction of someday leading to a covenant. But we're certainly not there. And Israel's very capable, has the best military, the best technology of any country in the Middle East and could be said of most countries in the world.

Steve Conover: Yeah. This news for us is unsettling. We have many FOI family, Friends of Israel family and workers in Israel. We have Jewish partners that are friends that we love and see frequently when we're in Israel. Can you give us a word of hope? What does the Bible tell us that ultimately will happen for Israel?

Jim Showers: Well, the first thing my mind goes through is the fact that God has promised that Israel will never cease to exist. Israel's enemies can attack Israel, but God will not allow them to prevail. And if you look at human history, you find one civilization after another that opposed Israel, sought to destroy Israel that does not exist today, but Israel's still here.

Steve Conover: Amen.

Jim Showers: There's only one explanation to that, and that is what the Bible teaches is that God has a very special covenant relationship with Israel. And part of that covenant promises protection. Jeremiah 31 God says that “unless the sun, moon and stars go out of existence, there will always be an Israel.”  And so that would mean unless this universe is destroyed, there will always be an Israel. And so I take that to be an ironclad promise by God that it is not that Israel won't face trials because they're part of the spiritual warfare that we talked about earlier. And they are particularly central to that spiritual warfare and what Satan wants to do to keep God from restoring His kingdom, which because the restoration of God's kingdom here on Earth is the end of Satan's rule over this earth. So to me, the great hope is that we don't have to fear what's going on, Steve.

Steve Conover: Amen.

Jim Showers: We should certainly pray for Israel. And one of the things people can do if they want to help is to give toward the Stand with Israel fund that we have or the Israel Relief Fund because those monies go over to Israel to help with humanitarian needs there. Israel's been through so much. Coming out of Covid, things were beginning to get back on track, and now October 7th happened, and suddenly their economy is really suffering. There is no tourism to Israel right now, and what happened yesterday is not going to bring it back anytime soon. So we know that Israel is going through difficult times. They are spending money right now taking care of evacuees from the North and the South, but there's also a loss of revenue from not just tourism, but other business. So they're spending extra, they have to buy weapons in order to fight these battles. Israel's under a lot of pressure economically as well as politically and militarily, but God has promised that they're not going to be eliminated. And that's a promise that is a forever promise according to the Lord. It's everlasting.

Steve Conover: And that really is a hopeful word at the end of this, to know that God's promises are sure. Thank you for taking the time to give us your insightful perspective today, Jim.

Jim Showers: Oh, you're welcome, Steve. Thank you.

Steve Conover: As the work continues in Israel, we'll keep you informed on what's happening. Our workers in Israel and around the globe are not able to do the vital work of standing with and bringing hope to the Jewish people without you. So please do not cease to pray for them. And as Jim mentioned, if you want to stand with us as we stand with Israel with a financial contribution, visit foi.org/standwithisrael. Again, that's foi.org/standwithisrael.

Chris Katulka: Thanks for joining us today for this episode of The Friends of Israel Today. I want to thank Steve and Jim for their great insight into what's going on in Israel. And next week we'll continue our regular broadcast. We will be looking specifically at the Passover Seder as the Jewish community all around the world prepares for Passover. Again, if you'd like to keep up with the news that's coming out of Israel, I'd encourage you to go to foiradio.org, there you can watch my Eye on the Middle East pieces. You can both see and hear them again by going to foiradio.org. The Friends of Israel Today is a production of The Friends of Israel Gospel Ministry. We are a worldwide evangelical ministry, proclaiming biblical truth about Israel and the Messiah, while bringing physical and spiritual comfort to the Jewish people.